Trillia Newbell is a wife, mother, writer, and self-professed lover of Jesus. She’s regularly published on high profile websites such as Desiring God, The Resurgence, The Gospel Coalition and Rapzilla to name a few. She is the lead editor of Karis and also a consultant on Women’s Initiatives for the Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission. If you’re not familiar with her or her writing—you need to be. This is why I decided to reach out to Trillia to ask her some questions and share her answers with you.
What are the advantages and disadvantages of living in the “Bible Belt”?
The advantage is it is easy to begin a conversation about Jesus. It’s almost expected. The disadvantage is it is easy to begin a conversation about Jesus—it’s almost expected. Because there are so many churches and so many people who claim Christianity, the real Good News can be watered down to a story about a man we celebrate instead of a redeemer for the world in need of saving.
I’m not going to lie. As someone who resides in the antithesis of the “Bible Belt,” it’s enjoyable to hear people openly talk about Jesus, or to regularly hear a shop keeper end the transaction with “God bless you.” However, I agree with you that it’s easy for the Gospel to get lost in southern culture.
I recently began reading your first book entitled United: Captured by God’s Vision for Diversity (Moody Publishers, March 2013). Without spoiling it, I’ll simply say that at one point of the book, you tricked me.
So my question is… are you the M. Night Shyamalan of book-writing?
Ha! That is great. Evidently I tricked quite a few folks. For those of you who haven’t read the book, in the introduction I share a story—that’s all I’ll say. As far as Shyamalan, I only wish! I’m not a great creative writer so writing United was a task. It was hard to add story instead of simply sharing facts.
I’ll take your word for it. Although… now I’m kind of wondering if the M. Night Shyamalan of book-writing would even admit if she was the M. Night Shyamalan of book-writing. Any who, I love the title of your book, and I am looking forward to completing it.
The word diversity itself is packed with diversity. Although, when I hear it, I’m often transported back to the context in which it was most used during my formative years (read: The 90s)—a context of ethnicity, which your book has addressed thus far.
Would you say that in addition to ethnicity, the church also commonly suffers from a diversity deficit with age, financial status, and interests?
Absolutely! I address financial status and interests especially as I describe how my friends and I benefited from meeting together regularly. But I do not address age. Age is a topic on its own. I imagine a book would easily be written about how to love and serve others in various ages, where the church is lacking, and the benefit of diversity of ages.
I ask because I am familiar with churches that are admirable examples of ethnic diversity (some of my best friends are diverse), but continue to suffer in other areas. I think you’re call to pursue diversity is healthy, and one we all need to hear. As far as age, you’re still young… you have plenty of time to address that one.
I have been fortunate enough to visit a churches all over the country (and sometimes world), and one thing that stands out—there is a church for every kind of person. There is a church for the mandolin loving, ironic mustache grooming, craft coffee drinking saint. There is a church for the ink scarred, jean vest sporting, bike gang saint—and of course there is a church for MMA fanatics.
Has our push to ‘contextualize’ caused us to lose even more diversity ground that we may have once had?
I’d love to explore your theory on contextualizing and the affect it has on membership. I do think that we can tend to cater to certain populations as a means of mission. In other words, a pastor feels called to minister to the poor so he puts a church in an impoverished area, adds a soup kitchen, and concentrates solely on that ministry. Or a pastor desires to reach the millennial population so he makes sure the worship band is comprised of young, guitar playing, modern Christian music singing, cool dudes. But what we all need is the gospel… that’s what we ultimately need.
I am not saying that any of these pursuits are wrong. I do think we want to be careful not to try to “reach” people and forget the gospel—their ultimate need.
Now does this hurt the cause of diversity? It sure can.
If our services are geared for young hipsters the senior adults may simply be put-off. I’ve seen quite a few articles as of late addressing this issue. People would encourage pastors to not only think about the diversity of members but the diversity of the church culture as well. But we must also remember that our leaders are men and they are trying their best to do what they believe is the best.
We can help, inform, and pray for them.
Besides the movement of contextualization, I think another movement to create programs has also had a devastating effect on both diverse and homogeneous churches alike. Programs tend to focus on niche interests, backgrounds, genders and age. Programs like a men’s retreat, a golden age luncheon, a women’s Bible study—or even the choice between a traditional and contemporary worship service.
Would you agree that our tendency to immediately categorize and separate people the moment they walk through the church doors is also contributing to a lack of diversity?
Absolutely! I think you are onto something here. We have a tendency to segregate our congregations with programs. I think we can fail to learn from one another as a result. However, I also think this could be a way to serve those who maybe wouldn’t be cared for otherwise.
With that said, I also think that one of the most effective ways to build diversity (and LOVE others) is to invite them into your home or out to lunch or dinner. We need to invite others who are not like us into our lives. That to me is what will serve members. We can’t practice the “one-anothers” in Scripture if we aren’t involved in each other’s life.
I agree. To be clear, I don’t think church programs are inherently evil. I do think the inertia behind them has snowballed into a beast that inadvertently teaches congregants to categorize themselves—people who are otherwise dynamic, unique and made in the image of God—into socially constructed safe havens. So then, why wouldn’t we also end up categorizing ourselves by birthplace, ancestry and physical appearance.
However, according to God’s word (i.e. Acts 17:26), there is only one race… the human race. A race that includes people of different sizes, shapes, melanin reserves and other categories. Even those with a secular humanistic worldview have arrived at the same biblical conclusion—through scientific research.
For example, The Human Genome Project which concluded that human beings are 99.9 percent identical genetically.¹ In other words, there is only a 0.1% difference between two people who are “white,” a 0.1% difference between two people who are “black,” and most importantly, there is only a 0.1% difference between a person who is “black” and a person who is “white”.
Furthermore, the visual differences between two people groups usually used to determine ethnicity (such as skin color, eye shape, etc.) only account for a 0.012 percent in a biological variation.² This means, there is practically no difference genetically between so-called “races”.
What am I laboring at here? Although what’s labeled “racism” is not logical and cannot technically exist—it most definitely does! It has for several millennia. In fact, to this day—and on a regular basis—some people groups experience a bias, oppression, hatred and even violence. All based on the constantly perpetuated lie that there is more than one human race.
So how can we remain faithful to the truth—what Scripture teaches—while simultaneously addressing and correcting a legitimate problem?
One way to combat racism is to call it what it is in biblical terms. Racism is hate and pride, it could be rooted in jealousy or bitterness. Racism is sinful. If we can get to the root then I think we can properly deal with it. Another thing we need to do is remember that it is real and continues to happen. I think we can adopt the notion that because we are out of the Civil Rights Movement, we’ve arrived. That is not the reality. We will be fighting racism until Jesus returns.
I wholeheartedly agree that we will be fighting sin until Jesus returns! In the meantime, call things what they are.
In addition to God being glorified and the Gospel made clear, what would be your hope for someone who reads United?
I’d love this book to be put into action. I give a few practical tips for building diverse relationships (like asking a neighbor over or teaching your children about the nations).
Lastly, what’s next for you? If you’re allowed to, and you wouldn’t mind, can you share with us what your next book will be?
My next project is called Fear and Faith and it will publish in 2015. I’m excited about this topic. I don’t think anyone is immune to the struggle of fear. I am praying people don’t feel alone in their struggle and are encouraged in their faith through this book.
Trillia, thank you so much for taking time out of your busy schedule to share with us over here at King Kulture. For those of you who are reading, I’d like to thank you as well! If you haven’t already please pick up Trillia’s latest book, United. Don’t forget to follow her on Twitter as well as her personal blog.
- President Bill Clinton, Prime Minister Tony Blair, Francis Collins and Craig Venter, Human Genome Announcement at the White House (2000), YouTube, 8:45.
- S.C. Cameron and S.M. Wycoff, The destructive nature of the term race: growing beyond a false paradigm, Journal of Counseling & Development, 76:277–285, 1998.